Supermodel Forum

This last build you need to erase all the code folder and check back the svn again to make it work.
Thanks Bart for helping us compile this emulator in the computer, this can fix many things, even the cpu performance too.

After compiling with (MAME) games, we will have in almost every rom moreover (epr-18022.ic2)

Which Supermodel doesn't use yet (Not emulated) but it would be great to add it,

MAME emulator uses it as a billboard (Lighting)

segabill.cpp

https://github.com/mamedev/mame/blob/ma ... gabill.cpp

sonic32 wrote:After compiling with (MAME) games, we will have in almost every rom moreover (epr-18022.ic2)

Which Supermodel doesn't use yet (Not emulated) but it would be great to add it,

MAME emulator uses it as a billboard (Lighting)

segabill.cpp

https://github.com/mamedev/mame/blob/ma ... gabill.cpp

I post the fix dat.

Not sure if this is intended, I normally play on keyboard & mouse so I've only just noticed it.

In Star Wars if you play on keyboard you get 3 separate bindings, on joystick/pad it's 2 key bindings with overlap.

(Using default settings. I appreciate some people change these anyway.)


Edit.
Just noticed to get a decent rumble in Star Wars, with xbox1 controller and Windows 10, you need to use "-input-system=sdl". I'm not sure if this is expected behaviour or I'm doing something wrong

Edit 2.
Just noticed all games feel massively different with "-input-system=sdl" and xbox1 controller. I always thought I had to use "-input-system=xinput".
I guess I'm the last to know, right?

How do effects feel in racing games for you using SDL? I'm actually surprised that joystick rumble isn't supported by the XInput system. Spindizzi recently contributed the SDL force feedback code and added joystick rumble. Presumably XInput was not updated to support this.

sdl use dinput and xinput functions from microsoft sdk, the same Supermodel uses in xinput and dinput. sdl is just a mix to simplify developpments (see inside sdl source code)
but yep, with a xinput controller, you can use sdl or xinput in Supermodel
I don't own xbox1 ctrl (just a xbox ctrl). so I can't feel differences between the 2 systems
"massively different" = strongest ?
The forces in swtrilgy are really weak on a ffb joystick. On a pad, the ffb forces are translated into rumble with more or less power (and they are really short in time) this means sometimes hardware has no time to react

Spindizzi wrote:The forces in swtrilgy are really weak on a ffb joystick. On a pad, the ffb forces are translated into rumble with more or less power (and they are really short in time) this means sometimes hardware has no time to react

I see, that's what I was experiencing in Star Wars. Really weak pulses of rumble that you can hardly feel with xinput.

Spindizzi wrote:"massively different" = strongest ?

Generally in all games, xinput feels very asymmetric. You are very aware of the two motors moving separately. A weaker higher rate wobble in one hand and a stronger slower rate wobble in the other. It's not a very convincing experience, it's more distracting than immersive. It feels quite mechanical.

SDL seems to amplify the strength somehow making the effect more satisfying. The whole pad rumbles so strongly you can't tell which motor is turning, feeling more convincing and natural.

Another difference is the rumble patterns don't match. There are times in games where you get a rumble with xinput but not SDL, while in other games SDL can be erratic where xinput would be quiet. Generally xinput better matches the action on the screen.

A very noticeable difference is Daytona. All the time you are steering with xinput you get a rumble. With SDL the rumble lasts for a split second then stops.

I guess this all proves how hard it is to translate ffb to just rumble. Rumble alone will never quite feel right or line up to ffb signals. Two different libraries/protocols and neither get it quite right. An ideal solution would be a mixture of the 2. The strong satisfying rumble of SDL with the better accuracy/on screen synch of xinput.

I wonder if the XInput system has additional logic to manage rumble effects (e.g., extending their duration and so forth)?

They definitely seem to process the signals differently.

Using the Daytona driveboard test menu,

xinput sends roll left to the left rumble motor and roll right to the right. The rumble continues until you roll the other way or centre.

SDL feels like it sends a signal to both motors, slightly more to the right, regardless of roll left or right, but only for about half a second then stops. The pulse is so short it's hard to tell exactly what's happening.

Its like an old radio, xinput has stereo rumble and SDL is mono.

Personally I prefer the mono style rumble. For me, a rumble pad will never be able to recreate the feeling of the steering pulling left or right. You just end up with a distracting asymmetric wobble.

Even if Supermodel is sending the ffb signals 100% correctly, I think there is going to be a difference between accurate emulation and what feels right to the user when using just a rumble pad.

Of course Supermodel should aim for accurate emulation and you guys are doing a fine job. It won't be long before you can drop a PC into a cab and nobody would be able to tell the difference.

I was wondering though, for us casuals who just use rumble pads and not wheels/cabs, can I change the source code so when ever a signal is sent left or right, it actually goes to both sides, regardless of input library? A "mono" rumble mode if you will.

r846
Introduce new config keywords.
In xinput mode, lets the choice to have left and right gamepad motors vibrate together

Wow. That was quick. I didn't even expect it to become a feature. Thanks for all the work Spindizzi. Very much appreciated.